Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

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Smitch
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:21 pm

Good afternoon

I am a new member and wish I was posting this under better circumstances.

I purchased the car in the subject in February this year from an enthusiast/ dealer/ restorer in Banbury, I have paid for the car and have all the paperwork and receipts etc.

After viewing and payment I left the vehicle with the individual who was going to complete a sympathetic restoration which should have been completed by September gone. However, the work hadn't been started when I last received a reply email from the guy a month or so ago??

The communication has been good up until this point but as of three weeks ago, he will not respond to my emails, calls, voicemails and texts. I am now fearing the worse, and feel I am at risk of losing both my car and my money :(

The Registration is; PHR 439R
Engine No on the V5; -32667
Chassis No: 2G-1381

The car is yellow and extremely original apart from having side repeaters fitted even though it is a UK car.

If anyone knows or hears anything at all please do let me know, I will also be contacting the police.

Apologies if I have posted this in the wrong place please advise and let me know where to post if this is the case.

Many thanks in advance of any assistance

Chris
Last edited by Smitch on Sat Nov 04, 2017 10:30 am, edited 2 times in total.

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RichardSEL
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2016 6:29 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby RichardSEL » Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:25 am

To report as stolen, you have to know that your car is stolen.
So that means actually going to the seller's premises to see whether the car's still there.
If you can't see the car, or the seller / restorer and the site appears to be vacated then
tell the tale to Police over the counter at the nearest station.

As you've got the V5 now in your name, and all proper receipts, they'll take it from there
placing the VRM on the Police National Computer (the PNC vehicle database is actually DVLA's)
with a stolen marker. That means that any inquiry or ANPR scan will flag it up as reported
LOS (Lost or Stolen)

You should SORN the car.
Did you check that the Chassis # was the same as on the plate?

For the restoration, that'd be a civil matter, not for Police -- unless deception or fraud was used in some way
Those accusations must be made with the assistance of a solicitor -- they're very complex to show

I've been retired six years now, so could be out of date
Hope you'll be reporting good news soon
Gone: '59 Mark I, '56 Mark VIIM, '59 Mark IX, '01 XJ8 Sovereign 4L LWB, '01 XJ8 Sport 3.2L, '01 XJ8 Exec 3.2L
Current: '03 Strange Rover L322
In trim shop for total refurb: '73 Owen Sedanca 4.2L
Stalled in storage '61 Mark IX with 4.2L

Smitch
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Sat Nov 04, 2017 10:23 am

Hi There


Thanks for the reply and advice, it is very much appreciated.

I do plan on going to the premises to see where the car is and if I cannot find it there go to the police station.

Fortunately, I have put the car on SORN.

All the numbers matched etc.

I am not too bothered about the restoration, would just like to collect the vehicle now.

Yes, hopefully, good news will follow

Many Thanks Again

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RichardSEL
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Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby RichardSEL » Sun Nov 05, 2017 4:48 pm

There is no SORN showing as of just now

I'm sure Thames Valley telephone call receipt's very good, but a personal visit across the counter means counter staff will ask questions as listed on a form (old fashioned paper but complete) that call receipt might not ask you. The sooner that's done, if you can't see the car at the restorer's / seller's premises, the sooner there's a chance the registration could be picked up by ANPR or other sighting.

If you can see the car but there's no sign of the restorer / seller then leave a note saying that as there's been no work done, you will be attending on <date / time> to remove it as it's your property. Give at least 14 days' notice. Advise Police of this <date / time> telling them there's a possibility of a Breach of the Peace and that you need Police presence.

If, when you turn up, seller / restorer's not there then you do NOT have power to break in and remove your property -- yet. You'll have to make application to a Court for an order to do that -- a qualified Bailiff (just like in Can't Pay? We'll Take it Away!) with qualified locksmith can do that though so long as they have an Order from the Court. Often such an order is granted by a Judge in chambers so you don't have to wait for the full Court process. That'd need a solicitor to make the application for you. I know it's tempting just to turn up with your friend "Knuckles" from down the pub but if it all goes wrong... ?

You''ll have to pay for the removal truck, which might need two visits :(
And arrange place to securely store the car.

Let us know how you get on? Good Luck
Gone: '59 Mark I, '56 Mark VIIM, '59 Mark IX, '01 XJ8 Sovereign 4L LWB, '01 XJ8 Sport 3.2L, '01 XJ8 Exec 3.2L
Current: '03 Strange Rover L322
In trim shop for total refurb: '73 Owen Sedanca 4.2L
Stalled in storage '61 Mark IX with 4.2L

Smitch
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Sun Nov 05, 2017 5:04 pm

Hi Richard

Thanks for the advice

I could have sworn that I had done the SORN? Anyway, I have logged on now and the reference on my V5 has allowed me to do it.

I will call at the police station in person with all my documentation and bank statements etc.

As frustrating as it is I would not risk getting myself in trouble and will pursue through the correct channels, just so frustrating that a so-called enthusiast and businessman could act in this way?

He is still trading on eBay and could well be a member on here? He is active on eBay as he has been adding comments over the last few days.

Thanks Again
Chris

Smitch
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:54 am

Hi Richard
I made my trip to Banbury and my car was at the premises where I agreed on the purchased, I was extremely relieved to see the car fully intact albeit with plenty of trim and other parts stacked up all over it.

The individual whom I purchased from also runs another business from the same premises and I managed to speak with a lady who worked there. she informed me that communication was not his strongest point? I then left a note giving 14 days notice that I would be collecting the car, a date to be confirmed within the next few days, I also then went to his home address and posted the same note through the door.

He will need to move some other vehicles out of the way in order that I can gain access to mine and I have emailed, text and also left another voicemail to confirm arrange a date for collection, I cannot believe that he still hasn't responded??

I have informed him that if I do not get a response confirming a date I will go ahead and organise collection and provide him with a date

I didn't call at the police station as I saw the car but I will make another trip down once I have arranged the date of collection.

Many thanks for your advice and concern, it is very much appreciated
Chris

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RichardSEL
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Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby RichardSEL » Wed Nov 08, 2017 10:57 am

Hi Richard
I made my trip to Banbury and my car was at the premises where I agreed on the purchased, I was extremely relieved to see the car fully intact albeit with plenty of trim and other parts stacked up all over it.

The individual whom I purchased from also runs another business from the same premises and I managed to speak with a lady who worked there. she informed me that communication was not his strongest point? I then left a note giving 14 days notice that I would be collecting the car, a date to be confirmed within the next few days, I also then went to his home address and posted the same note through the door.

He will need to move some other vehicles out of the way in order that I can gain access to mine and I have emailed, text and also left another voicemail to confirm arrange a date for collection, I cannot believe that he still hasn't responded??

I have informed him that if I do not get a response confirming a date I will go ahead and organise collection and provide him with a date

I didn't call at the police station as I saw the car but I will make another trip down once I have arranged the date of collection.

Many thanks for your advice and concern, it is very much appreciated
Chris
>> plenty of trim and other parts stacked up all over it

Are these parts from your car? If so, then on collection make sure you've got everything.
Those parts are worth money. I had a Mk IX in one shop. I had to have it taken away and have just got the parts back.
All thrown in a plastic tub with 2" of water in the bottom. The distributor cap had the period Champion spark plug connectors all cut off, a non-working fuel pump was thrown in, battery taken. And other parts of the period in new boxes ruined. Altogether some £500 to replace :oops:
All blamed on the body shop who'd done work filled out with fibreglass made to look alright, and then covered with primer and flattened, sill inners weren't made correctly. And the new sills were just tack welded on instead of continuous weld (MOT failure) Due to the length of time there (nearly two years), the rust had started to show through again :cry:
There are some right chumps purporting to be classic car restorers out there -- some may have been good in their past but they get to a certain time and just stop caring IMO. OTOH there's some good shops too -- most of them pricey :arrow:

Have you paid anything up front for restoration? If so then that's a civil matter unless fraud has been involved in some way. If you don't get all the parts back that you bought then it's only theft if you can prove no intention to return the missing items. "Oh yes! Here they are in a box I forgot to give you", is the usual retort.

If you have an agreed collection date (or a date that you've nominated) and you turn up with low loader to collect and can't then trespass on property if the offence. But you'd need a solicitor to draft out the particulars to submit to the Police. Straightforward theft and fraud type offences would be taken across the counter.

Let us know what's happening in a fortnight? Good luck :!:
Gone: '59 Mark I, '56 Mark VIIM, '59 Mark IX, '01 XJ8 Sovereign 4L LWB, '01 XJ8 Sport 3.2L, '01 XJ8 Exec 3.2L
Current: '03 Strange Rover L322
In trim shop for total refurb: '73 Owen Sedanca 4.2L
Stalled in storage '61 Mark IX with 4.2L

Smitch
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Wed Nov 08, 2017 11:08 am

Hi

My car is fully intact, the parts are from various other cars..

I will contact the police tomorrow if I haven't heard from him and get a date confirmed.

Thanks
Chris

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RichardSEL
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Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby RichardSEL » Wed Nov 08, 2017 11:43 am

They may attend if you report that there's a possible breach of the peace

They won't attend if you're going to collect on a pre-arranged appointment that's already been agreed between you both in advance

They will attend if you've reported trespass on property due to refusal (or non-attendance) of the seller to allow you to collect your car given a reasonable notice period -- often taken as 14 days minimum -- that date does not have to
have been agreed in advance

At the moment, there's no crime to report AFAICT
Gone: '59 Mark I, '56 Mark VIIM, '59 Mark IX, '01 XJ8 Sovereign 4L LWB, '01 XJ8 Sport 3.2L, '01 XJ8 Exec 3.2L
Current: '03 Strange Rover L322
In trim shop for total refurb: '73 Owen Sedanca 4.2L
Stalled in storage '61 Mark IX with 4.2L

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Tintin
Posts: 561
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:51 am

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Tintin » Wed Nov 08, 2017 11:55 am

Be prepared for the seller to want you to sign a waiver, conditional receipt or other paperwork before he will release the car - if so read it thoroughly, take your time and be careful what you sign. I had this happen to me once - I refused to sign a damage waiver on collection and had to leave the car at the garage who then threatened to charge storage fees because I didn't remove it!!

Robbie
1996 4 litre XJS Celebration 2+2
Daimler Sovereign S1 4.2 1971

Smitch
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Wed Nov 08, 2017 12:04 pm

Hi There

Thanks for the advice

Much appreciated

Kind Regards
Chris

Smitch
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Thu Nov 16, 2017 9:16 am

Good Morning All

Just to update everyone who commented and offered advice, thank you again.

I gave 14 days notice to collect the car which would have been Tuesday the 21st of November, even though the seller didn't respond I knew he had received my notice.

Due to his previous track record of not responding and not being available, and that I also knew he was still actively selling cars, I decided to make an unannounced visit yesterday.

Fortunately, the car was again still there and so was the seller, he was engaged with two gentlemen looking at a vehicle.

Long story short I managed to retrieve my car and enlist the help of two men with a trailer who delivered the vehicle to my premises last night.

Worry over and time to plan my restoration

Thanks again everyone
Chris

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Tintin
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Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Tintin » Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:28 pm

Good news - that must have been a great relief. Presumably the search will now be on for a restorer you can have confidence in and rely on. Keith Parrington at XJ Restorations springs to mind!?

Robbie
1996 4 litre XJS Celebration 2+2
Daimler Sovereign S1 4.2 1971

Smitch
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:54 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby Smitch » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:00 pm

Had emails back and forth with Keith and if I didn't live so far up North I would be definitely going to see him. Does a great job!!
I am meeting with a someone tomorrow to have a chat and look at what they do.

But yes, a MASSIVE relief, still can't understand why he was so intent on ignoring me?? Thankfully I can move on :D

Looking forward to getting the project underway

Will be posting with progress.

Thanks
Chris

richardpierce
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Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:38 pm

Re: Yellow Jaguar XJ5.3C PHR 439R

Postby richardpierce » Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:02 am

Where do you live Chris, we have plenty of Northern contacts and i used to own an XJC, I live in West Yorkshire

Let me know if I can be of help

Thanks
Richard


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